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Xrail system

 
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cybershooters
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Joined: 17 Jun 2006
Posts: 4587

PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2012 7:54 pm    Post subject: Xrail system Reply with quote

http://www.xrailbyrci.com/

Very clever, the question is: is it prohibited by section 5(1)(ad)? Hmm...
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cybershooters
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 01, 2012 6:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Have a read of this e-mail I got from the Home Office:

Quote:
Thank you for your e-mail about the legality of a device called ‘XRAIL’ system.

We are of the opinion that this item is not subject to control under section 5 of the Firearms Act 1968 (as amended).

It is possible that the item will be subject to section 1 of the Act and would need to be held on a suitably conditioned firearm certificate issued by your local police.

Under section 2(3) of the 1988 Act the item may need to be stamped by the ‘Proof House’ as you will in effect by adapting a shot gun. I have attached a link to our Firearms Law: Guidance to the Police 2002. Section 2.10 provides information about the proofing of an item and chapter 24 explains in greater detail the process for proofing firearms etc.

If you are in any doubt as to the status of any weapon, component part etc you are advised to discuss the matter with your local police firearms enquiry officer or seek your own independent expert technical and legal advice.

Yours sincerely

M Young


Wow. Practical shotgun will never be the same. Wonder what the Proof Houses will make of them.
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Bob



Joined: 28 Jun 2006
Posts: 176

PostPosted: Wed Feb 01, 2012 10:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Now I'm confused.

It appears to be a set of rotating magazine tube extensions so how does that make it a Sec 1 firearm in its own right and why does it need proofing?

Does the Choate extension tube on my 1100 need proofing?
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cybershooters
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2012 6:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Because component parts of a shotgun are unregulated normally, but this is a component that turns it into a section 1 firearm so the argument would be that it is a component part of a firearm and subject to control and has to be on the FAC. Maybe (as it's not pressure bearing, but it is a fixed component, plus do you need a variation if a dealer replaces the current tube and you don't possess it separately? Probably not.)

Shotguns have to be inspected when the mag is restricted to 2 shots under section 2(3) of the 1988 Act, so obviously this would be tampering with it, hence the reinspection, but that would be with a section 2 shotgun that was being adapted.

Anyway, long and short of it is that these things are legal on a section 1 shotgun. You may need to get a variation to get one though if you want to assemble it onto the gun yourself.
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Bob



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PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2012 7:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I still don't see it.

The XRail attaches to the end of the existing mag tube, just like my choate extension does. It just has some fancy gizmos to make it rotate and line up additional extensions to the main tube.
Attaching it to a restricted mag shotgun would have the same effect as attaching any other extension tube - none at all.

You'd have to attach it to a shotgun that was already section 1 for it to work.

Must be horribly unwieldy to have 23 rounds sitting (mostly) under the muzzle end of the shotgun though.
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caxton



Joined: 29 Jun 2006
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 03, 2012 12:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I already have two S1 shotguns so I don't see there being anything to stop me adding this, just as I added mag tube extensions without 'permission'. A bit extreme though. I'd need to go on a muscle building course.
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Carrot Cruncher



Joined: 17 Sep 2006
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 03, 2012 12:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Steve was makingthe point that a smooth bore revolver gun is prohibited by section 5(1)(ad) as anybody who recently bought a Taurus Judge under the vermin control exemption found out.
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caxton



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PostPosted: Fri Feb 03, 2012 1:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Carrot Cruncher wrote:
Steve was makingthe point that a smooth bore revolver gun is prohibited by section 5(1)(ad) as anybody who recently bought a Taurus Judge under the vermin control exemption found out.


Interesting point. It is connected to the straight magazine tube though, so not feeding the gun directly and it's not pressure bearing, unlike the Taurus Judge. I don't see much difference between this and those drum- type magazine conversions you can get for remmies, such as the Knoxx Sidewinder and, of course, the perfectly legal 20 round drum one for the Saiga 12. Magazines are not regulated in the UK, cylinders are.
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cybershooters
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 03, 2012 7:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The argument is (which the Home Office were vacillating about) whether any tube which you screw on, x-rail or otherwise is section 1. The Home Office always hedge their bets because they know those responses might be produced in court. Which is why it says "it is possible". Because section 57(1)(b) says "any component part".

All you really need to know is that they consider the x-rail to be the same as an extension tube. The rest is down to the police and the courts. The Home Office are responsible for section 5. They're saying it's not covered by section 5, that is the relevant point.
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cybershooters
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 03, 2012 7:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

caxton wrote:
I don't see much difference between this and those drum- type magazine conversions you can get for remmies, such as the Knoxx Sidewinder and, of course, the perfectly legal 20 round drum one for the Saiga 12. Magazines are not regulated in the UK, cylinders are.


There is a very important difference compared to the Saiga magazine - that magazine is detachable, and it is well established that a detachable magazine is an accessory, not a part, which is why the Firearms (Northern Ireland) Order 2004 specifies that a detachable magazine is a component part.

We're talking about a fixed magazine here. Whether that is a "component part" is open to question, and is why the Home Office hedge their bets.
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