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rusmilitary.com has pre-95 AKs for suprisingly cheap price?
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duracell128



Joined: 29 Jan 2008
Posts: 23

PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2008 12:50 am    Post subject: rusmilitary.com has pre-95 AKs for suprisingly cheap price? Reply with quote

I'm planning to get an AK for dry firing and training, pre95 deactivated AKs tend to go for minimum 600, but rusmilitary.com sells them for 300ish and claim they are pre-95.

http://www.rusmilitary.com/html/c-deact_ak103.htm

I also have another question, I've seen plenty websites where they are selling new spec, but says it can dry fire cock, stripped etc., but does not say its old spec though.


I'm confused.

Thanks in advance.
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Otto



Joined: 21 Feb 2007
Posts: 43

PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2008 1:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

They are manufactured post '95. But the key words are: factory-deactivated.

Here's an extract from their site regarding the factory-deactivated SVD:

Quote:
... until very recently when Oleg of Rusmilitary had a batch manufactured at the factory to comply with UK regulations. As these specially made examples have never been intended to fire live ammunition, and cannot be modified to do so, they are field strippable and can be used for training and familiarisation purposes, unlike former live firing weapons which now have to be hacked about and welded up to meet current government requirements.

http://www.rusmilitary.com/html/c-ak_press.htm

As for the other sites, they are probably the above. Feel free to post them.
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cybershooters
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Joined: 17 Jun 2006
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2008 6:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If it's not done to UK-spec it's a realistic imitation firearm. Section 38(7) and (10) of the Violent Crime Reduction Act 2006. Illegal to import, manufacture or sell.

The European Commission is currently working on an EU-wide deac spec as per the revised European Firearms Directive, unlikely they will recognise de-activation standards from outside the EU.
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duracell128



Joined: 29 Jan 2008
Posts: 23

PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2008 9:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

They still seem to sell it though, they have uk office and all that and from the way I see it I'm ASSUMING they were pre-VCR import. (hence them running out of stock)



What's is the specific deactivation standard for PRE-95 automatic rifle?


I've looked everywhere, but all I found was 'less stringent'


thanks
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cybershooters
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2008 6:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

There's no grandfather clause in the Act. It's been illegal to sell realistic imitation firearms since the start of October. The Act specifically says that only UK-spec deacs are exempt from the definition of a "realistic imitation firearm" so I don't care what it says on their website. The implementation of the ban was delayed expressly so that shops could sell off their stock, according to the Home Office.

And even if it wasn't illegal I can't see the point because they have no value, you can't legally sell it.

There is no big difference between the pre-95 and post-95 standard for most deacs, only for SMGs and automatic rifles. So you see a lot of companies selling stuff saying it is "pre-95" style but it's just a marketing con because the deac spec didn't change significantly.

What it means with automatic rifles is that you can cock it and the action still works, so you can dry fire it. With the post-95 guns the bolt has to be removed or cut in half and welded in place, and the trigger mech is knackered. Some still have moving triggers but the hammer is missing or welded in place.

Either way the barrel is slotted the length of the handguard and a steel rod is welded in. And the chamber is pinned.

The better option imo is to buy an LMG, because they can still have working actions. If you buy an RPK for example. Plus it's still legal and post-95 so it will retain its value. This is probably what is causing your confusion because a lot of LMGs are simply assault rifles with slightly longer barrels and bipods.
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Otto



Joined: 21 Feb 2007
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2008 10:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

They can still be imported if they are a trader and intending to sell for the purpose of TV/theatre, museums etc.
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cybershooters
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2008 6:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's a legal defence for someone charged under the Act to claim that, which is different from a specific exemption. This was argued about at some length in the committee stage over the Bill.

Because of the nature of the offence (i.e. it's not a particularly serious one, 51 weeks in prison is the maximum) this leaves it in the hands of a magistrate to determine whether the activity was lawful or not, i.e. on a case by case basis.

Which basically means you have to be very careful...
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Steve.

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duracell128



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PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2008 8:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

There's a shop that's asking me G3 w/bipod for 650 (classified as LMG)


good deal you reckon? Manufactured by Enfield though.
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duracell128



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PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2008 12:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Does anyone know a good dealer for Deacts besides DWSUK and deacticved-guns?

cheers
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cybershooters
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2008 7:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Worthing Guns for handguns. World Wide Arms for military surplus stuff.

If you want something specific you have to talk to arms dealers like Imperial Defence, Conjay Arms, Helston Gunsmiths, etc. Most of them don't actually do deacs, but they are section 5, you need to get them to get it and then send it to a dealer who can deactivate it.

But don't bother asking unless you are serious about buying as they don't like time wasters...
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cybershooters
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2008 7:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

duracell128 wrote:
There's a shop that's asking me G3 w/bipod for 650 (classified as LMG)

good deal you reckon? Manufactured by Enfield though.


Sounds like a lot for a G3, but I gave up trying to figure out what was a good deal on a deac a long time ago. A lot of stuff "manufactured" by Enfield was actually made by H&K in Germany and then marked as being made in the UK to avoid German export laws (which H&K denies, but it can be easily proven by contacting the Ulm proof house). H&K would ship the stuff to Enfield, then it would be exported from the UK (for example on Yugoslavian contracts). The only way to tell is via the proof marks. A lot of G3s were made at Enfield though, IIRC. If you see an H&K 21 or MP5 with Enfield markings though, those were made in Germany.
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duracell128



Joined: 29 Jan 2008
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 13, 2008 9:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Got a question,

Can 'new spec' AK's handguard be removed? reason is that I want to put handguard rail for putting optics on (for dryfire training)


cheers
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cybershooters
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 14, 2008 2:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Probably, depends on the specific deac, check before you buy. On the post-95 ones sometimes they weld the tube for the gas piston in place, so you can't change the top handguard.

I have to say it's not a wise move to fiddle with deacs, even in a minor way. I dare say a handguard change isn't going to raise too many eyebrows but there have been loads of cases where people have been successfully prosecuted for fiddling with them. Even if they don't get you for restoring to working order, they get you for possession of component parts.

You're okay bolting a scope on or something really trivial like that, but altering the fundamental appearance sets off warning bells. Don't think they won't find out either, it only takes one vindictive ex-girlfriend to whinge to a copper friend of theirs, it has happened on more than one occasion.
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pmercer



Joined: 25 Aug 2008
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 25, 2008 3:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dont forget that if a firearm was built as a section 1 firearm, ie, a section 1 AR15, when it is deactivated, it can have full moving parts, compared to a section 5 AR15, which will be welded up.

Something a lot of people don't know.
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cybershooters
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 26, 2008 12:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

There's a bit of a debate actually as to whether that can be done based on the way the FSS phrased the deactivation guidebook for the Proof Houses, because the spec A for AR-15s is specifically described, IIRC. Check with the Proof House you intend to use before attempting this.
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